The RG65 ICA Working Group has now finalised the Constitution and Regulations and after considerable consultation with many of you are happy to publish Version 1 of the 2021 documents.
There has been universal agreement with the final documents, so we are ready to move to the next phase.
Shortly we will be calling for nominations for National Class Secretary and National Class Associations in each country. Please discuss your country’s nomination within your Association, group or fleet in preparation for our request. Each country will be required to sign a Membership Agreement, which can also be viewed on the website (https://rg65.org/association-documents/).
In May we will be calling for nominations for Officers of the ICA
The inaugural World Council meeting will be scheduled for a date in June to formally elect Officers and accept the Constitution and Regulations.
To continue working the Working Group has appointed an interim committee to act in the designated roles. The temporary appointees are:
Chairman
Wayne Stobbs (UK)
Secretary and Web Officer
Vangelis Simonidis (IRL)
Technical Officer and chair of the Rules Committee
Achille Chatin (FRA)
Officer and chair of the Events Committee
Andrew Cook (AUS)
This interim committee will stand down during the first meeting of the World Council to allow the first elected committee to take over.
In parallel the Rules and Events Committees will recruit some committee members from the RG65 community to so that they can start their work.
The Rules Committee’s first task is to review the Class Rules and issue a 2021 Draft for consultation, while the Events Committee will start to work with the nations to set up some international events starting in 2022.
Thank you all for your support so far and we look forward to the next few months where we will look to put all this work into action. We are doing this for and on behalf of you, the RG65 community. To do this we need you to guide and help us, so please let us know if you would like to work with us to continue this work. We need an engaged and committed committee to represent the class, and it is the class who must decide who that committee is.
Yours Faithfully
Wayne Stobbs, for and on behalf of the RG65 ICA interim committee.
As many of you will already know work is going on in the background to create a Constitution for the RG65 ICA to help ensure that the ICA, ICA Committee and the World Council of RG65 Nations manages and promotes the class in a transparent and effective manner.
A lot of progress has been made so far and after some extensive review and edits by our RG65 National Representatives we feel that ware ready to present the proposal to all of you, the RG65 community.
Firstly some background of what it is all about
What is this Constitution we talk about.
Simply put, it the the contract that the ICA Committee must abide by when they do work for the ICA, and how they work with the National contacts, called the World Council. Who is the World Council…. it is Your National Representatives.
This is not a “contact” for/with the Owners of RG65, or in any way the Rules for building and sailing an RG. These are just the terms that the ICA Committee and your National Representative need to abide by when we work together.
They are there to support you to build the class in your Country.
Why is it so long
We need to make sure that we do not just think of the ICA as it is “today”. We need to prepare for the years ahead when we will be a much bigger class, attracting more people and Nations, and running international events. All of this future is built into these documents already.
What is the difference between an NCA and an NCS
An NCA and and NCS are the two types of class associations that you might have in your country
An NCA is a National Class Association and is a formalized association with it’s own Committee and Constitution.
An NCS is a National Sailing Secretary, and is an informal association in a country who appoint a “Secretary” to be the contact person with the ICA.
There can only be 1 NCA/NCS in a country. This prevents a group of sailors from splitting away from the rest and trying to set up they own relationship with the ICA.
From and ICA point of view, it makes no difference if your nation is represented as an NCA or an NCS, you have the same rights and influence within the World Council.
Why is it split in 3 documents, a Constitution and Regulations and a Memorandum.
Usually a Constitution does not need changes in the future, and so this document should be fixed for many years, and any changes will need 67% votes to make any changes, and Only the World Council can vote on changes to this. The ICA Committee can only propose changes, but cannot vote on them
However, there are some things that will change as we grow and learn, and these things are covered in the Regulations. For these we only need 51% vote to make a change. In fact in some classes the committee has full control of making changes without the need to consult with anyone outside the committee. I do not agree with this way, not for the first few years anyway as we must all work together to make the class what we want it to be, therefore the World Council votes on any changes.
The 3rd document, the Memorandum is a direct contract that should be agreed with each country NCA/NCS (as I talked about above), and may end up being slightly different each time. So please view these as a Templates
Voting rights in the World Council
This is probably the most difficult part of the whole process, how many votes does each Nation have.
In some classes the votes are allocated according to how many boats are registered in the country. This is very difficult to maintain accurately
In some classes every Nation gets 1 vote, and nations that have been represented at a World Championship in the last few years get a second vote
In other classes the votes are allocated according to how many people took part in the Country’s National Championship
and
and and….
For a class where we are today none of these ideas will work, but might do in the future. At the same time we need to respect that there are some of you that have 1 boat in your country, some who have 300 or more, and so we need to have a system that respects this. The idea in the Regulations may need tweaking, or if you have some other ideas the please share them
What will the ICA give to you
The whole point of formalizing the ICA through a Constitution is to ensure that the ICA and the ICA Committee are accountable to all of the stakeholders in the RG65, the World Council, every Owner, club and nation that organize events etc etc. The ICA has no intention to favor one nation, or group of nations, over another. The ICA is there to help you service the owners in your country. Some of the things that we will do include:
Give you a voice/vote when making decisions made or proposed by the ICA and World Council.
Support you to establish and grow the class in your Nation.
Give you a set of class rules that are clear and well written.
Give you a mechanism to propose changes to the Rules.
Give you a way to get an Interpretation of any of the class Rules
Create a worldwide racing network, including events at continental and world level.
Create channels and forums for all the RG65 stakeholders to communicate and share information.
Set up a Website to keep everyone informed about that is going on. Vangelis is already well on the way with this. www.rg65.org
What does it cost
There are no costs associated with you our your Nation being part of the ICA.
So, onto the review of our documents.
Please can you review these documents and if you have any comments or suggestions, either:
Add them to the Google Document using the comment feature
Happy Reading and thank you very much for your time and support in the process. Together we can get the RG65 Class to start rapidly growing and very soon have some international events.
Hello RG65 Stakeholders. I hope you are all well and getting ready for a season ahead, if you are allowed to have one in your country.
I want to keep you updated on what is going on behind the scenes with regards to the ICA.
As I am sure that all of you will know a proper functioning ICA needs to have a set of rules by which the ICA Committee must adhere, and this also extends to how your National Representatives work with the ICA.
The RG65 have up till now had a reasonably informal constitution and relationship with the class associations/groups in each nation and, while this has been OK up till now, it needs to be tightened up if we want to properly establish ourselves as a Class that attracts the best r/c sailors from around the world.
I, together with a small working party, have created a draft constitution which over the last few weeks was reviewed by some of you, and now it has been circulated to all the National Representatives for comment. We have already has some good feedback and suggestions for change.
It will take a few more weeks to gather this feedback and make the necessary changes before a 2nd review, but hopefully soon thereafter we can put the wheels in motion to have it formally adopted by the World Council. This World Council will be made up of the ICA Committee and 1 person from each country who are your voice at the ICA.
The process to adopt this constitution is set out within the constitution, but generally follows the following process.
The interim ICA committee will announce the date of a Special Meeting of the World Council, giving at least 6 weeks notice of the meeting. Part of the Announcement will be a copy of the final constitution documents to be adopted.
4 Weeks before the meeting each Nation will supply the committee with information necessary to determine how many votes each member of the World Council will have
Because any vote to do with a change to the constitution takes the form of a “special resolution” your National Representative on the Wold Council must consult with all their members and vote accordingly. So you all have a voice on this, and I encourage you to use it.
At the meeting, because it is a “special resolution”, it will need 67% of the votes cast to be in favour for the constitution to be accepted.
I hope that you will accept our proposal for a constitution once it is been adjusted according to the comments from your National Representative as this will then give us the change to take on the next challenges which include issuing an updated version of the Class Rules and hopefully in 2022, at the latest, some International Events.
I must thank all of you who are supporting me, not only Vangelis, Achille, Andrew and Agustin who are my “Working Party”, but all those with whom I am having parallel conversations. I could not be doing this without all of you.
As always, if you have any comments of suggestions, please let s us have them. We are here working n your behalf.
In previous posts I mentioned that I had started to survey the RG65 Nations so that I could get a better understanding of how the RG65 class is established around the world and how the Nations run and manage the class.
I asked the 18 nations that we have contact details for and so far 14 have replied. This is a fantastic response rate and I would like to thank all of you who took the time to reply and share so much information with me. If you have not yet replied, please do so when you can.
I won’t go into too much detail but I think that it is worth me sharing some basic insights with you, and please fee free to add your own comments to this. The more information that I have the better I can direct how we move forwards.
The first part that I gathered information on what how big the class was in each region. It is always difficult to get accurate figures on because boats come an go. Just because someone built and sailed a boat 5 years ago does not men that that boat still exists. So much of this information is a “gut feel” and we cannot expect more. Fredo shared with me that around 1,000 kits for an RG65 were sold in Argentina, but we know that only a fraction of these ever made it to the water.
National Class Sizes
The responses from the 14 Nations show that on average there are 104 boats per nation, with a maximum of 300 and a minimum of 1. This is quite a wide spread as I am sure you will agree.
Number of actively raced Boats
Of those Boats that exist, how many are “actively used”. Here we see the the range from 0% to 100%, and this equates to an average of 30 boats per nation that are active. The largest being the UK with 125 and France with 90, Germany 60 and so on. It would be great if we could, by raising the profile of the RG65 class, get these numbers up significantly.
National Championships
I followed on with some questions about National Championships in the countries. Here we see that 6 Nations hold a National every year, 2 Occasionally and a further 5 plan to start holding National Championships. Of the 8 Nations that currently hold events, the average number of entries is 24, ranging from 10 (USA) to 35 (UK)
Class Associations
When asked whether a Class Association existed in the country, 9 Nations confirmed that they had some sort of class association, and of those 5 were recognised by their National radio sailing authority.
Sailing Authority
Asked what “Sailing Authority” the class sails under, 6 sail under World Sailing, 1 under NAVIGA, 5 under “Other” (I still ned to dig a bit more what Other is), and 1 indicated that they Don’t Know.
The last area that I surveyed was about the future. How they felt a future ICA Constitution and Class Rules should look like, and the results from these are much as I expected.
Future Constitution
50% of the respondents indicated that they would like the Constitution to fall under the World Sailing umbrella, 14% do not mind, and 36% would like to it be totally independent. This needs further exploration and I will enter into some direct discussion with the nations to decide the best way forward.
Class Rules
The alignment of the Class Rules to a Sailing Authority was exactly the same as the Constitution, 50% World Sailing and 36% independent. But what is overwhelmingly clear is that everyone wants the Rules to remain fundamentally as they are. By that I understand the view to be that the boat length, mast height, sail area and self certification concepts should not change.
My Conclusion
Well I don’t really have a clear conclusion yet. I will engage with some of the National Representatives who have not given clear views one way or another so that I can get a better understanding of what direction we should follow, and I will try to complete this within a week or 2, whereafter I will come back with some proposals.
Thanks you for your patience as we go through this process. I need to understand fully what the Class wants before I start to propose any changes, and as you can see from the results above, there are some very differing views. In the end we will need to find a solution that works for the majority.
Please keep your opinions flowing. It is Your class.
We are pleased to announce that we have a new RG65 ICA website which you can find at www.rg65.org
There is still a lot to be added, but in the meantime please head over to the Forum section and start to engage with the RG65 community.
This website will be our main source of information, updates and discussion in the future so please follow us and subscribe to updates in our Blog section.
If you have any comments about the site then please send them to Vangelis, our Webmaster
Hi Everyone, I thought that it was about time that I gave you a short update on what we have been doing behind the scenes at the ICA since I assumed the Chair in 1 January.
You will recall that some of my first tasks were to get an understanding of how the RG65 class runs in the various countries and at the same time try to set up a working party to help me develop the ICA further so that it better serves the RG65 class internationally. So what has been happening about this.
A few days ago I sent out a mini survey to all the National Representatives to gather some information about the size of the class in their countries as well as how it is run and operated, and then to gather their thoughts about how the ICA should go about establishing a working constitution and revised set of rules. We have received a number of responses to that survey and what they show us is that on a national level there are big differences in the size of fleets but also big differences in how the class is run and administered, none of which is a surprise to me. What we are seeing is that everyone wants to see some improvements in the way the Rules are set out and also that the ICA needs to be formalized through a Constitution but with differing views on what format that constitution and the rules should take. I am going to leave the survey running for another week or so and then will report back to you all with more details and then start to come up with proposals on next steps.
Moving onto the Working Party, I am pleased to say that we have some early take-up and so far we have Vangelis Simonides from Greece and Ireland, Andrew Cook from Australia and Achille Chatin from France taking an active part, with a number of others offering their services too. What I want to ensure is that the working party is representative of the whole world and so we are still seeking volunteers from North and South America, so please volunteer if you think you can represent those regions.
Vangelis has also volunteered to become our Webmaster and his first task is to totally revamp the website. Between us we have decided to set up a totally new site rather than use the old site as a starting point. Work is progressing well on moving all the content from the old site to the new one and we hope to launch the new site in a few days. The new www.RG65.org will have a Forum section for everyone to share and discuss topics and ideas and so once it is launched I will encourage you to sign up to it and use it. We will try to ensure that this forum is not used for any commercial purposes, and we ask all of you that are commercially involved with the class not to use it as an advertising platform for your business.
Thanks again for allowing me to take over the Chair of the ICA, and ask always, please drop me a line if you need or want anything from me.
I will further update you on progress in a week or two.
I would like to start off by thanking Fredo for giving me the opportunity to take over the Chairmanship of the RG65 ICA.
Back in 2014 Fredo stepped forward to run the RG65 ICA and I am sure that you will all join me in thanking Fredo for his time and effort while in charge. During his tenure Fredo has faced many challenges and he has always approached things to the best of his ability and we wish him well for the future. I am sure that we will still see him active in the class.
It is my opinion that the RG65 Class has a great opportunity to grow into something that serves the social sailor as well as those that want to become an international champion, while retaining its independence and Corinthian ethos of fair and unregulated participation, but to do so we need seize the opportunity and structure the class properly before something else takes our space.
The small size, high performance, low(er) cost, simple Rules and friendly nature of our Class makes it very attractive to everyone, and we must not lose these properties as we evolve it.
I feel that I am able start to bring about the changes necessary to set our Class on a track that will allow it to grow and establish itself, not only in the Nations where it is currently active but in many more, not only on the level it is now but expanding further into the social sailing end of the spectrum but also to the top end where it will be attractive to the World Class sailors from other fleets, and in so doing get all those people who have a boat stuck away in their house gathering dust to get it back onto the water.
The first things that needs doing are that the International Class Association (ICA) needs to become more defined, active and transparent. So how do we do this?
We need to Define the ICA and this means setting down some rules on how the ICA will be managed and run. I intend to establish a “Working Party” of 5 or 6 people that represent all the Nations to work with me to create a set of rules by which the ICA should operate. Many of you will know that these rules may take the form of a Constitution, but how that Constitution will look will, and must, be agreed by all stakeholders
The ICA needs to become Active with our promotion and communication to all RG65 stakeholders. This will include regular website updates as well as communication with the National Associations
Transparency is for me very important. The class does not belong to me, the ICA or anyone else and so the ICA needs to become totally open about it’s vision and steps it will go through to achieve its goals. I therefore intent to make it very public exactly what we are doing.
Start looking at the Class Rules to bring them up to date and clear up some inconsistencies. How far we go with this task will be up to you, the Stakeholders.
I expect that that it will take a few months to achieve these first steps done, or at least progressed sufficiently to allow them to be voted on by all of the RG65 Stakeholders.
I hope that you all trust that I will do the best I can for the Class, and that you will all join and support me to make this happen.
In August last you got a Mail from me, requesting you to present Candidates for getting in charge of the RG65-ICA. To that there were only TWO answers: one offering “general help” and some sound advices, and one from Wayne Stobbs.
Wayne, friend and collaborator of RG65-ICA from long time ago, offers himself to Manage the RG65-ICA.
As at today, December 31, I counted all the received approvals (so far only 3 countries missing), and we find that NOBODY expressed some objection. Or, in other words, there are
15 Welcomes, with 3 Countries without answer so far.
As I wrote: “if there are more approvals more then rejections, I will hand over the whole control of RG65-ICA to Wayne” And so will it be!
Today I CONFIRM THAT WAYNE STOBBS is the Chairman of RG65, starting at 0:00 Hs UTC of January 1, 2021!
To Wayne I assure my full assistance, to the best of my abilities, and am sure he will take us on the right path!
To Wayne I wish success, to ALL RG65 Sailors, to Everyone,
I wish you Fair Winds, and Good Luck! Fredo Vollmer (Past RG65-ICA Chairman)
After cooperating with the Work Group set up by IRSA, the following Joint Statement has been agreed. The possibly most important words included are those that recognize “the RG65 ICA, an Independent Class Organization, not affiliated to any International Association”. This Category is also recognized in IRSA´s Constitution, and allow the Class to develop all the usual events, with the only exception of those that include the terms “World”, “Continental” and Championship” in their denomination.
Future Directions for the 65 Class: A Joint Statement
November, 2017
65 Class Rules Working Party Forum
This Forum was set up in March 2017 within the IRSA site to bring IRSA, the worldwide radio sailing organization as an affiliated member of World Sailing, together with delegates from the RG65 ICA, an Independent Class Organization, not affiliated to any International Association, and a substantial Observer Group from both organizations.
The prime purpose of the forum was to focus on a set of proposed rules developed by IRSA that would be acceptable for international and continental championships under WS and IRSA guidelines.
Over the ensuing months many items were discussed and many changes agreed on resulting in a newly named set of rules for the international community: 65 Class Rules. This name variation is intended to separate those rules in custody with the RG65 ICA from those now to be published that are in the international standard IRSA format.
The IRSA delegates would like to thank the RG65 ICA delegates and the contributing members of the Observer Group for their valuable input into helping make these 65 Class Rules more acceptable and viable for international competition.
IRSA hopes that the rule discussions have established more confidence in the way we act as an international organization and we also hope that the RG65 ICA and IRSA can work more closely to further advance this class with its growing popularity.
Similarly the RG65 ICA delegates would like to thank the IRSA for the work done in developing the proposed rules and bringing this forum together as part of their ongoing support of International RC Yachting.
In the near future IRSA will publish the updated 65 Class Rules including the agreed changes. This means that international events using these 65 Class Rules can then be run with the confidence that they are under the authority of World Sailing and the IRSA.
Early in 2016 IRSA wrote a set of ‘internationally acceptable’ rules for the RG65 class and submitted them to the RG65-ICA for comments. In April 2016 these rules were shared with the RG65 community. These rules were rejected after consultation with you, the RG65 community, in June 2016.
After that IRSA insisted on setting up a Workgroup with RG65-ICA to go over their rules and discuss them. Starting in March 2017 and for the next nine months a team of three representatives for IRSA, three representatives for RG65-ICA and about 20 observers from both sides were able to ask questions about any item in the rules.
The RG65 team worked hard to get IRSA to adopt the current RG65 rules without modification. After a lot of negotiation it became apparent that this would not be possible and so the ICA team sought to protect the RG65 class in its current state. The Workshop has never the less been a very rich experience that exposed the complexities of rule writing. It also showed how passionate we are about our class.
IRSA continued to, and still do, want to establish a set of rules which would be suitable for competition at World Championship level under World Sailing/IRSA and the ICA team worked with IRSA to adjust their proposed rules so that they reflect much of what the RG65 class stands for. This was achieved in some cases but not in others.
The result of all this, culminating in the recently released Joint Statement, is that the RG65 class will continue to operate as it always has done. But in addition IRSA will soon release this set of rules that will allow competition at a World, Continental and International Championship level. As things stand, the vast majority of boats that currently comply with the RG65 rules (published in 2014) will also be able to comply with the new IRSA rules .
But again, let’s be clear, the only people that would need to ensure that they comply with these IRSA rules are the people that want to take part in the World, Continental and International Championships run by IRSA.
Through this process we have ensured that the RG65 class is able to continue operating as it has for the last 40 years.
